About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Discussion about the development of the Assembly workbench.
User avatar
xsuper9988
Posts: 210
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:20 am

About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by xsuper9988 »

The number of features changed after "PartDesign Object" was modified
It caused "Elements of ASM3" to change
Finally resulting in "ASM3 Solve" exception

AsmAxis_BallScrewModule86_SupporUnitStart_Base > Elements018 > Elements017 > Elements20 >...

It destroys several layers
Is there a quicker solution?
Are all relevant parts rebuilt?
Is there any way to prevent this problem?

PS:
"Two yellow circles" is the modified part of PartDesign
"Green Circle Element027" is one of the Elements that has changed position

My Ver.

Code: Select all

OS: Windows 10 (10.0)
Word size of FreeCAD: 64-bit
Version: 0.21.29283 (Git)
Build type: Release
Branch: master
Hash: 15e3e86c5a683f3b2e5c7b95d4b26cd719ab367a
Python 3.8.13, Qt 5.12.9, Coin 4.0.0, Vtk 9.1.0, OCC 7.5.3
Locale: Chinese/Taiwan (zh_TW)
Installed mods: 
  * A2plus 0.4.56a
  * Assembly3 0.11.3
  * Assembly4 0.11.12
  * Curves 0.4.4
  * DynamicData 2.46.0
  * ExplodedAssembly
  * fasteners 0.3.43
  * lattice2 1.0.0
  * parts_library
  * pcb
  * sheetmetal 0.2.49
Attachments
ASM3_Element_01.png
ASM3_Element_01.png (173.37 KiB) Viewed 552 times
ASM3_Element_02.png
ASM3_Element_02.png (172.54 KiB) Viewed 552 times
ASM3_Element_03.png
ASM3_Element_03.png (221.04 KiB) Viewed 552 times
Last edited by xsuper9988 on Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
bambuko
Veteran
Posts: 1549
Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2019 12:53 pm
Location: UK, England, North Devon

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by bambuko »

If you change design so drastically as to confuse FreeCAD which feature is used to create element,
it is not surprising that solver gets confused as well.

It happens sometimes,
if you use FreeCAD to "design" (which usually means things change ;) )
as opposed to using FreeCAD to "model" existing/fixed design.

If this happens (and it does happen to me sometimes as well)
I usually quickly re-establish correct elements by selecting correct geometry and "dragging" it to the appropriate element.

Never caused me more than just passing inconvenience... :P

That's why BTW it is so important (in my humble opinion) to give elements meaningful names/labels to help in future,
rather than relying on system assigned ones.
User avatar
xsuper9988
Posts: 210
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:20 am

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by xsuper9988 »

bambuko wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 11:59 am If you change design so drastically as to confuse FreeCAD which feature is used to create element,
it is not surprising that solver gets confused as well.
"Prototypes" are usually designed and changed all the time
I think only rebuilding...
I just want to see if there is any better suggestion
Still thank you very much for your reply
Hope someone else has other better suggestions
User avatar
bambuko
Veteran
Posts: 1549
Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2019 12:53 pm
Location: UK, England, North Devon

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by bambuko »

xsuper9988 wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:56 pm ... Prototypes" are usually designed and changed all the time...
That's exactly the point I am making ;)

xsuper9988 wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:56 pm I think only rebuilding...
the only things you need to rebuild is the affected elements
unless the "damage" is more serious and changes constraints as well


xsuper9988 wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:56 pm Hope someone else has other better suggestions
I would be very interested :ugeek:
realthunder
Veteran
Posts: 2164
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 10:55 am

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by realthunder »

Based on your description and screenshot, it looks like a classic TopoNaming problem. And since you are using the upstream FreeCAD, it is kind of inevitable. The best I can suggest is to create element in as early as possible in body features, so that modification in later modeling steps won't affect the element.

Or, you can try my branch of FreeCAD, which has basically solved this jumping element problem. If the model changed so drastically that it still fails, it will show you exactly which element failed, and you can simply drag and drop the correct geometry to fix it.

There will soon be a TopoNaming branch in upstream for user to try as well, but it is expected to take several months to reach the same range of support of new TopoNaming in PartDesign.
Try Assembly3 with my custom build of FreeCAD at here.
And if you'd like to show your support, you can donate through patreon, liberapay, or paypal
User avatar
xsuper9988
Posts: 210
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:20 am

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by xsuper9988 »

realthunder wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:50 pm Based on your description and screenshot, it looks like a classic TopoNaming problem. And since you are using the upstream FreeCAD, it is kind of inevitable. The best I can suggest is to create element in as early as possible in body features, so that modification in later modeling steps won't affect the element.
Is there a more detailed example to refer to?

realthunder wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:50 pm Or, you can try my branch of FreeCAD, which has basically solved this jumping element problem. If the model changed so drastically that it still fails, it will show you exactly which element failed, and you can simply drag and drop the correct geometry to fix it.
I tried it but it is very different from the standard version... XD

realthunder wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:50 pm There will soon be a TopoNaming branch in upstream for user to try as well, but it is expected to take several months to reach the same range of support of new TopoNaming in PartDesign.
I am very much looking forward to the update of "TopoNaming"

Thank you very much for your help and reply
User avatar
bambuko
Veteran
Posts: 1549
Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2019 12:53 pm
Location: UK, England, North Devon

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by bambuko »

bambuko wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 11:59 am ...I usually quickly re-establish correct elements by selecting correct geometry and "dragging" it to the appropriate element.
My bad :( sorry
My recommendations were based on my experience of using @realthunder LinkStage3 branch.
I should have remembered that master branch experience is different...

@xsuper9988 it is very different from master, agree but once you move to it you will never want to go back :mrgreen: :lol:
User avatar
xsuper9988
Posts: 210
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:20 am

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by xsuper9988 »

bambuko wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 8:43 am My bad :( sorry
My recommendations were based on my experience of using @realthunder LinkStage3 branch.
I should have remembered that master branch experience is different...
I'm actually worried about a problem
Years later "Standard Version", when "LinkStage3" is completely incompatible
Will ASM3 become orphaned...???

I still appreciate your help and reply
bambuko wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 8:43 am @xsuper9988 it is very different from master, agree but once you move to it you will never want to go back :mrgreen: :lol:
But I'm very used to using the standard version
And before I tested and found that LinkStage3 has some problems in other workbenches
I am using other workbench
The last time I used the FEM workbench to calculate the results there was a difference
User avatar
bambuko
Veteran
Posts: 1549
Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2019 12:53 pm
Location: UK, England, North Devon

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by bambuko »

xsuper9988 wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:11 pm ...I'm actually worried about a problem
Years later "Standard Version", when "LinkStage3" is completely incompatible
Will ASM3 become orphaned...???
Assembly3 is (and should remain) compatible with both master and link branch,
but bigger danger (in my humble opinion) lies in the fact that there is no standard assembly workbench.

All three main "contenders" i.e. Ass2+, Ass3 and Ass4 are experimental proposals how to solve assembly issue.
None of us know which way things will go...

There are plenty of workbenches that no longer work because the original developer is no longer involved :cry:

And here lies the biggest danger (again - in my opinion) - both Link branch and Assembly3 are one man shows.
Whilst I do not doubt for a moment realthunder's commitment, life has a habit of throwing us surprises... :shock:
I just hope he remains well and interested in the project :ugeek:


xsuper9988 wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:11 pm But I'm very used to using the standard version...
I am not trying to convert you :lol:
Link branch is experimental and only for those who enjoy it ;)
User avatar
xsuper9988
Posts: 210
Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:20 am

Re: About "Features of PartDesign" change causing "Solve for ASM3" exception,please help

Post by xsuper9988 »

bambuko wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:32 pm All three main "contenders" i.e. Ass2+, Ass3 and Ass4 are experimental proposals how to solve assembly issue.
None of us know which way things will go...

There are plenty of workbenches that no longer work because the original developer is no longer involved :cry:
Yes
I'm also afraid of this
bambuko wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:32 pm And here lies the biggest danger (again - in my opinion) - both Link branch and Assembly3 are one man shows.
Whilst I do not doubt for a moment realthunder's commitment, life has a habit of throwing us surprises... :shock:
I just hope he remains well and interested in the project :ugeek:
Yes
I also thanks to realthunder
Also thanks to Ass2+, Ass3, Ass4 developers
Because I've been testing them too
bambuko wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:32 pm I am not trying to convert you :lol:
Link branch is experimental and only for those who enjoy it ;)
Maybe someday something will change
I will use it too

PS:
By the way, where do I go to find "forum syntax", I don't know how to tag people...

Thank you very much for your reply
Post Reply